Talent Builds Discussion

[kreelor]

DK: Why can't I choose "Unholy" Talent Build for DK?

I began searching and reading the hundreds of threads before asking this question, but it got mind-boggling.

So, I'll ask here why the Zygor Talent tool allows building ONLY Death Knight "Blood" path and not the other two?

I want to use the "Unholy" path, but Zygor keeps throwing up warnings whenever I try.

Am I not doing it correctly, or is it Zygor's Talent Calculator that doesn't work (except for the "Blood" tree path)?

[cabby]

What are the exact warnings that the talent advisor gives you?

[kreelor]

Screenshot

What are the exact warnings that the talent advisor gives you?

Okay. I made a screenshot while viewing the Zygor Talent Build screen.

It shows (at the bottom of the image) that I have the "Unholy" path selected.

But, Zygor allows only one Talent path: "Blood".

I tried the "Configure" option, but it doesn't offer any other builds to choose from.

It's the same whether "Leveling" or "PvP" is chosen.

Why?

OH, CRAP! THIS FORUM DOESN'T ALLOW ME TO INSERT THE IMAGE! DAMN!

I guess you'll have to try it (Death Knight "Unholy" Build) yourself. I'm really surprised that all DK players choose "Blood" and nothing else. Otherwise, there might be a post somewhere about this issue.

I expected Zygor to allow me to choose any of the 3 builds that Blizzard offers to players, and use it as I level-up.

[Kamchak]

The talents given by the talent advisor is used for the builds that are best for leveling, or use in PvP.
Not every build is useful in leveling a toon.
Prot / holy pallies are not as efficient in leveling as ret.
Resto druids are not as efficient in leveling as balanced.
Unholy DK's are not as efficient in leveling as blood.
Survival hunters are not as efficient in leveling as BM.

The builds given go side-by-side with the purpose of the leveling guide, and that is solo leveling a toon from 1 to 80.
While unholy is a more DPS producing build, it is not the best to level from 55 to 80.

With all that said, in this very thread you will find builds for any type of game play you want to experience, and a way to produce them into a talent advisor of your own.

As far as letting you use the talent builds you want of the three options given to you, Zygor does not keep anyone from picking their own talents. Im not sure what that statement is suggesting, but even in the talent build suggestion you can select one that is not part of the build. There is nothing to prevent you from doing this.

[kreelor]

Thank you for answering!

I suppose what you said (pasted below) is what is bothering me.

As far as letting you use the talent builds you want of the three options given to you, Zygor does not keep anyone from picking their own talents. Im not sure what that statement is suggesting, but even in the talent build suggestion you can select one that is not part of the build. There is nothing to prevent you from doing this.

I understand that I can "override" specific talent suggestions, by choosing others manually. But, I'd have to do that with each and every talent, if I wanted to play my char with the "Unholy" path! That means that the Zygor Talent Advisor won't work automatically (the way I think it should).

Blizzard designed the game to allow users to select any 1 of the 3 paths as a primary path. Zygor's Guide robs us of that choice.

The "leveling" aspect of the guide should still work it's "magic" by eliminating such things as superfluous, or idiotic quests, etc.

I'm just really surprised at this limitation.

By the way, I created a temporary web site just for my Zygor issues, so that I could present screen captured images, etc.

Here's the link:
Note:
-- Link to web site removed since the web site is no longer needed to display images. --

[Kamchak]

So lets take your discussion topic line-by-line, as I'm not sure why this is an issue.

I suppose what you said (pasted below) is what is bothering me.

"As far as letting you use the talent builds you want of the three options given to you, Zygor does not keep anyone from picking their own talents. Im not sure what that statement is suggesting, but even in the talent build suggestion you can select one that is not part of the build. There is nothing to prevent you from doing this."

I understand that I can "override" specific talent suggestions, by choosing others manually.

You can choose this method, or you can read about creating the talent build you want and turn it into a function that works exactly like the provided talent builds, as stated in my post....

"...but even in the talent build suggestion you can select one that is not part of the build. There is nothing to prevent you from doing this."

But, I'd have to do that with each and every talent, if I wanted to play my char with the "Unholy" path! That means that the Zygor Talent Advisor won't work automatically (the way I think it should).

Again, there are builds in here and the way to set it up as a in game build advisor. Im sure it is easier to set this up than setting up an entire website, no?

Blizzard designed the game to allow users to select any 1 of the 3 paths as a primary path. Zygor's Guide robs us of that choice.

And you are being ''robbed" how? This is not a Blizzard product, but a leveling guide. Yet, even as such a product, there are all builds provided on the Zygor forums (this very thread, as I eluded to in my post), and instructions on how to set up your own build, if you choose. Your choice of wording should be less liberal here. Giving you a leveling guide along with a leveling talent build is by no means 'robbing' anyone, even in the wildest definitions possible for that word or phrase.

I will post again; you can make your own talent guide and turn it into an in game build.

The "leveling" aspect of the guide should still work it's "magic" by eliminating such things as superfluous, or idiotic quests, etc.

Zygor et-al has taken out the quests that place a player into a running around for little xp scenarios, and gives the players the best xp to get you from on level to the next in the shortest amount of time possible. The removal of 'superfluous, or idiotic' quests is an ambiguous statement, as in the opinion of every player, there are quests all will find to match your criteria. Still, the guide functions and forms itself very well to the needs of the buyer; leveling solo in the shortest amount of time possible.

I'm just really surprised at this limitation.

There is no limitation given to you. In fact, and once again, there is nothing that says you are required to use the talents given to you. This falls completely under the topic of 'your choice.'

By the way, I created a temporary web site just for my Zygor issues, so that I could present screen captured images, etc.

Here's the link:
www.kreelor.com/

So now I have to ask; how is it that setting up a talent advisor with the tools you have at your disposal is harder (so you make it seem in your posts) than setting up a website?

Perhaps you can provide us with some builds you feel are superior to the in game talent guide, as so many others have done for this thread

Sorry. I dont get your insistence on a problem or a problem that is an easy fix, with the solutions provided to you, if you choose to use them.

Good luck on your website though.

[kreelor]

I dont' want to argue with you, or anyone.

I'm sorry, but you sure appear to be rather defensive about this issue. You wrote a lot, but skirted around my main point. I merely wanted to know why Zygor doesn't let users choose their preferred talent path, and then use it automatically, instead of forcing users to use only one. I noticed the choices weren't included, so I asked why.

If I want to create a "custom build," you said there are tools, etc. on this web site that tells me how to do it.

You said:

So now I have to ask; how is it that setting up a talent advisor with the tools you have at your disposal is harder (so you make it seem in your posts) than setting up a website?

So, now I have to ask you; if it is as easy as you say, then why weren't the two other paths added into the Talent Advisor?

By the way... it took me only 20 minutes to create that web site.

It is not my aim to set a "World Record for Blazing Speed in Leveling to 80". However, leveling efficiently is my aim. That's why I bought the Zygor Guides.

The following is slightly off-topic, but it relates to 'leveling speed.'
Speed counts (somewhat), but it's not the most important thing in the world (to me)! If it were, then why does the Guide send me 2,500 yards on foot (no riding mount) to go kill one guy for a quest, then 2,500 yards back again to turn in that quest, when there are 4 quests within 25 yards of where I'm standing? It happens quite often with this Guide. I've never understood that, either.

It seems unfair for me to buy a product and then have to modify it by writing code, etc. to do something that I believe should already be in the program. After all, you said it was easy to do, so why wasn't it done? If the other two paths aren't as good, then Blizzard should be told to eliminate them from the game (like the guide did).

After paying for the products, I really didn't want to get involved with coding it myself. That's all I'm trying to say. I'm done with this topic.

Thank you for replying. I do understand what you said. I wish you understood me. I'm happy with the Guide, except for a few things about it.

[cabby]

First, not trying to argue or anything like that, just answering your questions/concerns.

So, now I have to ask you; if it is as easy as you say, then why weren't the two other paths added into the Talent Advisor?

The short and simple answer to this is that the Talent Advisor is part of the leveling guides and as such only includes the builds that Zygor feel are the best ones for fast solo leveling. Zygor was nice enough to build in the functionality for his users to create their own builds and use them with the Talent Advisor, this is something he didn't have to do.

I know you may think it's frustrating, but even I don't like to do much coding if I can help it and if you look at the bottom half of the first post of this thread you'll see I have it spelled out for the easiest way to make a build for use with the Talent Advisor and only requires you to copy/paste about 3 lines into a file and name the file Build01.lua. It can't get any simpler than that really for you to have complete control over which talents the Advisor will use. There is also another method that involves a little bit more typing but it's no more difficult than typing out a shopping list to take with you to the grocery store.

[Kamchak]

...Thank you for replying. I do understand what you said. I wish you understood me. I'm happy with the Guide, except for a few things about it.

Was not defensive at all, but I will 'defend' a product when I read things like people thinking they are "robbed" because the product does what it is not only advertised to do, but that it does very well.

This is a leveling guide. You read the sales page of a leveling guide before you bought a leveling guide. The sales page told you this will take you from level 1 to lvl 80 in the fastest time possible. It does just that.

I read your issue, sir/mamm. My stance is the same, however. The talent choices are given to you as it is the most efficient leveling build available.

Does this mean there is no other build to use? Of course not. Wowpopular.com has many, many builds that people use.

So, now I have to ask you; if it is as easy as you say, then why weren't the two other paths added into the Talent Advisor?

As Cabby posted, these are not ideal talent paths to get your toon to level 80. If Zygor gave his customers options that did not work, he would not be selling a guide to get the users to 80 as fast as possible.
For example, the survival tree for a hunter gives the user much more DPS than the beast master tree... once the final point can be placed in explosive shot. Until then, the survival tree is sub-standard for solo leveling.
Why would a solo speed leveling guide provide a sub-standard talent choice that goes against what it is designed and advertised to do?

It seems unfair for me to buy a product and then have to modify it by writing code, etc. to do something that I believe should already be in the program. After all, you said it was easy to do, so why wasn't it done? If the other two paths aren't as good, then Blizzard should be told to eliminate them from the game (like the guide did).

Some of the builds are good for PvP and not for PvE, and vice versa. Some of the builds give you abilities some raiding guilds are looking for, where other builds dont fit that need for a certain toon. And there are builds to use after you hit 80 to give you maximum DPS, or health, or defense, depending on what you are going to do with that new level 80 toon. That is why those talent choices are still there.

I will add that once I hit 80 on a toon I usually head straight for the trainer to get max DPS builds in my talent trees, if I havent been working on it already with the dual talent ability.
My warlock, for example, is demonology and destruction. I use demon build to get me through the daily quests, as this is a better build to use than destruction. The destruction build gives better DPS, and is used in dungeons and raids.
The affliction build works similar in nature to the demonology build, but is not my style of play, so I dont use it. There is another warlock in my guild that is affliction, as he prefers it to demonology. We do similar DPS, so all is good.

My druid is balanced and resto.
My DK is unholy and frost.
My mage is frost and arcane.
My pally is prot and ret.

I get your post and your issue... I do. But this is not what this guide was advertised to do, designed to do, or bought by you and I to do.

To answer your question about the running around to complete a simple task without a mount is.... the xp for that quest justifies doing that quest vs doing any of the other quests available that will have you go further to do far more for far less xp.

And Ill say it once more; this is a leveling guide to get a person from level 1 to level 80 as fast as possible.

So if you choose to consider my replies arguing, I don’t know what else to post to help you out.

The guide gets you from 1 to 80 fast. That is what you bought. It will not do everything. It cant do everything. We did not buy it to do everything.

Not sure what else to say.

What you are looking for is in my first post to you. I’ll leave it up to you to pursue what you claim to desire.

Cheers

[mblaze360]

So I am trying to get help...

...making my own builds and using the talent advisor. Can i also input glyphs. *sorry didn't go through the whole thread) if so do I have to use the long written format, or can i use the link to this build numbers? thanks for the help in advance. Also while I am asking noob- like questions, am I limited to one build per lua file? ex. all my shammy specs in one lua file as opposed to resto being one enhance being one etc.
Again thanks.

[cabby]

I'm not sure how to add in glyphs with the build numbers link, but I imagine it could be done. I've only ever seen glyphs included with the long, typed out builds.

Yes, you can have a ton of different builds all in one .lua file.

[deleon]

...making my own builds and using the talent advisor. Can i also input glyphs. *sorry didn't go through the whole thread) if so do I have to use the long written format, or can i use the link to this build numbers? thanks for the help in advance. Also while I am asking noob- like questions, am I limited to one build per lua file? ex. all my shammy specs in one lua file as opposed to resto being one enhance being one etc.
Again thanks.

I've got two builds added to my build01.lua file so you're not limited to one (both are selectable). I did them the long way and have added glyphs. I'm not sure if glyphs could be done with the numbers. I was too far in before I made these two builds but I've been told that if you want to rush to the bottom of your primary talent tree (i.e, titan grip for fury warrior) then finish maxing the earlier talents it has to be done with typing out the tree, you can't do that using numbers.

[mblaze360]

I see

Thanks for your help guys it is good to find a forum community that helps instead of flames. I am very grateful.

[psironix]

Heal Druid Talentguide

Hey Zygor Community+Zygor himself ;D
Can u do me the Build01.lua data with that spec:
05320001000000000000000000000000000000000000000000 00000000230033312030520531353313051
Pls it would me help alot
I LOVE ur Guide
I´m lvling so much faster now^^
EDIT:
The full armory Link:
http://www.wowarmory.com/talent-calc...20531353313051
EDIT2:THX 4 the Quick answer

[cabby]

Here ya go:

if not ZygorTalentAdvisor then return end

ZygorTalentAdvisor:RegisterBuild("DRUID", "Custom (11/0/60)",  "0532000100000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000230033312030520531353313051")

Installation Instructions
1. Create a new file named Build01.lua and copy above into it.
2. Place inside of .../ZygorTalentAdvisor/Builds/.

Replace the ... with the current file structure you're using to place your World of Warcraft file in.

Windows XP:
C:/Program Files/World of Warcraft/Interface/AddOns
Windows Vista & Windows 7:
C:/Users/Public/Games/World of Warcraft/Interface/AddOns
Mac:
Macintosh HD/Applications/World of Warcraft/Interface/AddOns


Note: This is just a quick conversion for you and doesn't include any of the glyph stuff. Since you already know what you want for glyphs you can just pick them up since you still have to manually put them on the glyph page.