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So speculate how long until MOP? June, August, October, December or ?

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    Dev Watercooler - Mists of Pandaria Looting Explained Pt.2

    Bonus Roll

    We have one other new system that will use part of the personal loot model. This is what we're calling the bonus roll.

    Once upon a time, raiders had to invest a lot of time and effort every week preparing for a raid. This felt kind of cool in the abstract because it built anticipation, rewarded players who prepared for raid night, and otherwise just added a little more ceremony to the act of entering the dragon's lair to seek glory and treasure. The reality is that you spent your time killing mobs to farm flask materials or gathering Whipper Root Tubers. The reality didn't match the fantasy and we eventually greatly minimized the need to farm consumables altogether. Of course, that led to another problem, as raiders would log on for raid nights, finish, and then have nothing to do the rest of the week. The bonus roll is intended to give those players something to do that is hopefully more enjoyable than grinding elementals or Blasted Lands boars. We want to see players out in the world doing stuff, and we want that stuff to be a little more interesting (if not downright fun) than farming mats.

    The way it works is like this: We have two major Pandaren factions, the Elders and the Craftsmen. Completing daily quests and scenarios for each group earns you one of two currencies. The Craftsmen tokens are spent mostly on cosmetic items. The Elder tokens are spent mostly on power items. The intent here is to let players who want some optional content to be able to devote time to both Craftsmen and Elders, while more min-max focused players or players who don't want such a time commitment can stick to Elders. The Elder tokens can be used to purchase head enchants, some nice purple items, and the kind of gear you've come to expect from factions. However, they also sell an item called a Charm of Good Fortune. Imagine you can complete a quest once a week to buy one Charm for 25 Elder Tokens. You also might be able to save up a few charms, but you won't be able to hoard them until the next tier of content.

    If you have one or more Charms of Good Fortune, then whenever you kill a raid boss (in Raid Finder, normal or heroic) then a new UI window will pop up asking if you want to spend your Charm on a bonus roll. If you click yes, then you'll instantly get another shot at that boss's loot table! You will always win something from the bonus roll, such as a pile of gold, gems, or flasks. However, you also have a small (but not miniscule) chance of receiving a piece of epic loot. As with the personal loot system, the item will always be something designed for your current spec. Also, just as with personal loot, the game doesn't analyze if you already have the item, if the item would be an upgrade for you, or if you prefer axes to swords or anything like that.

    Most importantly, winning a bonus roll has no effect on what other players win on their bonus rolls or what the boss drops normally. If you have saved up several Charms (this will probably happen when you play but don't raid every week) then you can use one per boss, but you can't cash in multiples on a single boss kill. If you want to save up all of your Charms for the final boss because he (or she in the case of the mantid raid) drops weapons or whatever, that is your prerogative, but you'll only be able to spend one per kill. If you want to save up your Charms for heroic bosses, go for it.

    Here is an example of per-person loot and the bonus roll in action:

    Stan is a death knight.
    Jim Bob is a warrior.
    Naomi is a hunter.
    The three friends run Raid Finder together and tackle Mogu'shan Vaults. They get matched with a bunch of random folks from across their region. On the fourth boss, the Council of Kings, the game decides that Jim Bob wins an item. Jim Bob is a Fury warrior, so the game is either going to give him a two-handed Strength axe or a Strength bracer, because those are the two Fury-appropriate items on the Council of Kings loot table (in this theoretical example). Regardless of what Jim Bob wins, Stan might also win the same items. Naomi won't ever be offered those items, because they aren't appropriate hunter loot. If she had gotten lucky and earned loot for the kill, it would have been hunter appropriate.
    Let's say Naomi is frustrated because Bob and Stan both won loot and because the trinket she wants won't ever drop. So, she decides to use a Charm of Good Fortune. Let's say she gets lucky and the game decides that she won an item instead of gold, flasks, etc. (Thanks, game!) She might get the trinket she wants, or she might get an Agility neckpiece that is also on the Council of Kings loot table. Her winning an item doesn't affect Stan or Jim Bob or anyone else, even if they use their Charms as well.

    Okay, we're almost done here, but I did want to mention two other relevant changes.

    Area of Effect Looting

    Yes, we are doing area looting. After killing a group of enemies, you may have a bunch of corpses lying around (perhaps because you went all Bladestorm on a bunch of hozen). If you loot one of the corpses, the loot window will include items from all of the nearby corpses for which you have loot rights. Some recent games have incorporated a similar feature, and it's one of those things that players just want in their MMO these days. It's already in and it works fine.

    The Future of Valor

    The second change I want to mention is that we plan to adjust the role of Valor points. Valor (or the various other names that the currency has had over the years) was originally added to WoW for two reasons: it helped to mitigate really bad luck, for those times when the boss just refused to drop the item you wanted, and it helped encourage players to stay with the group even if they didn't need anything off the next boss.

    Over time, we have felt like Valor has taken on too prominent a role, to the point that it risks becoming more important than actual boss loot. This is particularly the case when the tier sets are available on the Valor vendors. We think killing dragons and ransacking their hoard is more epic than shopping at the magic armor store, so we want to shift back toward boss kills being the primary source of epic PvE gear.

    In Mists of Pandaria, Valor will be used to power a new feature that allows you to increase the item level of your existing epic items. This means that each week, you can become a little more powerful, hopefully allowing you to kill that boss that has eluded you thus far. There will be a bit of a game in trying to decide when to upgrade your gear versus hoping for a new piece to drop from a raid boss, but our plan is that even heroic gear can be upgraded slightly in this way.

    We won't allow you to upgrade Raid Finder gear so much that it becomes better than normal gear, but imagine if you can increase your item level by around eight points. At this time, we're thinking there won't be gear on the Valor vendors at all, but we'll see how that shakes out. Valor will come primarily from dungeons (including challenge modes) and scenarios. You might earn a little from daily quests and raiding as well, but that won't be as efficient.

    Final Thoughts

    That's a lot of information to absorb all at once I know, and I'm sure it will lead to dozens of questions. It'd be more helpful to us if you were to focus your discussion on how things will feel, and the basic rules of the system, instead of immediately leaping to the conclusion that you've figured out some exploit and ergo the whole thing is doomed to failure. We've stitched up a lot of the egregious loopholes already and the system is a little more complicated behind the scenes than I figured was worth getting into here.

    Check it out in beta if you get the chance. Let us know how it feels. We have time to iterate and refine this stuff. Good luck on getting the loot you want, too... but not too quickly.

    Greg "Ghostcrawler" Street is the lead systems designer of World of Warcraft. The first epic item he can recall getting was the Drillborer Disk.
    I'm Rebur, Tadia, or Judianna most games.
    Twitter @Chaos5061.
    Translations are done with Google Translate.

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      Quest Rewards: Spec-Specific Loot

      Currently watching some streams while my beta installs, and I'm seeing that items that are being rewarded at the end of quests are specialization specific. I love the idea of this; however, there are some people who will not level as a healer thus they are losing out on healing gear. I was wondering if you could change it so the options are class-specific loot where we have the choice to choose specialization specific or one of the other pieces.

      Thanks.


      Offering quest rewards this way is a change for us, and the kind of thing for which we could definitely use feedback.

      For the players that level as X spec but want to also collect gear as Y spec, we have a few solutions:

      -- Several of the zones have vendors with decent gear that isn't quite at the quest item level. These help provide coverage if you miss a reward, say gloves or shoulders, since questing is less linear now. However, these vendors also help you gather off-spec gear.

      -- Several quests, especially those that offer blue rewards, weapons, trinkets and most of the level 90 quests, offer you a choice of gear for all of your specs instead of just your current spec.

      -- Because the questing in zones isn't as linear as Cataclysm, and because there are two zones per level in some cases, you'll have the option to hit some quests as spec A and some quests as spec B.

      -- There are still other sources of gear, such as crafting, the AH, dungeons, faction rep and so on.

      Also remember that if, for example, you level as Arms but want to tank a few dungeons as Protection, that the level-up dungeons are not so brutally difficult that you need full tanking gear. A Prot warriors in DPS Strength gear would do just fine. As you get into endgame content, especially normal raids, you'll want actual tanking gear.


      I like the concept, but I'd think at level 85+ we wouldn't need hand-holding as to which quest rewards we can use, especially if they've already been winnowed down to ones appropriate for our class. It seems kludgy to run around and swap specs just to see if there's a good upgrade (or alt tab out to WoWhead), particularly if my other spec's gear isn't as good as the one I'm using to quest.

      We don't players to have to feel like they should do this. Keep in mind that you would need to be pretty min-max focused to agonize over whether you want the healing or the DPS legs when you'll probably get a new set of legs in an hour or two. It starts to matter more as you get closer to level 90 and the rate of upgrade slows down, but as I said, you'll generally get options on those quests.
      I'm Rebur, Tadia, or Judianna most games.
      Twitter @Chaos5061.
      Translations are done with Google Translate.

      Comment


        From Blizzard:
        Heads up. 100,000 Mists of #Pandaria beta invites are on their way to Annual Pass holders.
        I'm Rebur, Tadia, or Judianna most games.
        Twitter @Chaos5061.
        Translations are done with Google Translate.

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          Remember the FAQ. The order in which annual pass gets in is how long you've benn playing wow then at what time you signed up for the annual pass.

          They have not said if the eairler tonight beta invites we're annual pass or just more media. I do know though that Medros from All Things Azeroth got in eairler and if not mistaken got in on a press invite don't think he signed for annual pass. So it could be these are additional invites.

          They have said that opt-ins will not be getting into the beta until after all annual pass people. Also remember that the last number for annual pass subs was over 1 million people and this invite is only for 100,000 of them.

          I myself don't expect to get in until the second week of April if I'm lucky. And that is only if they invite 100,000 annual pass people once a week. That could change if they invite more at once or invite more than once a week.
          I'm Rebur, Tadia, or Judianna most games.
          Twitter @Chaos5061.
          Translations are done with Google Translate.

          Comment


            from blizzard another hundred thousand mop beta invite have going out
            I'm Rebur, Tadia, or Judianna most games.
            Twitter @Chaos5061.
            Translations are done with Google Translate.

            Comment


              Would be just my luck if I got a beta invite right now with no Internet. Power transformer blew. Have power but the side of town that hosts my Internet is out.
              I'm Rebur, Tadia, or Judianna most games.
              Twitter @Chaos5061.
              Translations are done with Google Translate.

              Comment


                Hows that for response Internet back.
                I'm Rebur, Tadia, or Judianna most games.
                Twitter @Chaos5061.
                Translations are done with Google Translate.

                Comment


                  Yesterday’s 100,000 Annual Pass-holder beta-test invites ran through the night, and we’re still in the process of notifying the invitees by email. Those selected for yesterday’s wave of invites should all have the Mists of Pandaria beta client available for download through Battle.net account management, and they should all receive the email notification by end of day today. If the beta client shows up for you in Battle.net account management, you don’t need to wait for the email in order to download the client and begin testing.

                  We’re off to a solid start with the beta test, and things are looking good in terms of realm stability, so we’re ready to invite another wave of Annual Pass holders. A second wave of invites is going out to 100,000 more Annual Pass holders today, starting right now.

                  If you’re added in this or any subsequent wave, access to the beta client will show up in Battle.net account management as discussed above. Please check there today and tomorrow, as today’s wave of invites will be processing throughout the day and likely into early tomorrow morning. Notification emails will also be going out, but again, no need to wait for the email if the beta client is available to you through Battle.net account management.
                  I'm Rebur, Tadia, or Judianna most games.
                  Twitter @Chaos5061.
                  Translations are done with Google Translate.

                  Comment


                    MoP Beta in Maintenance for ETA One Hour: http://us.battle.net/wow/en/forum/topic/4253972138
                    D3 Beta may also be affected.
                    I'm Rebur, Tadia, or Judianna most games.
                    Twitter @Chaos5061.
                    Translations are done with Google Translate.

                    Comment


                      Those bums still haven't sent me my beta email. You'd think that they would have been nice and let me in on my birthday, but nooooooo. Then I think, 'hey my first and last name are both pretty low in the alphabet maybe they'll let me in with alphabetical order', but nooooooo. They better get their act in gear before I decide to do a coast to coast road trip and bust down their corporate door. I've already got the beta client installed and waiting.
                      My Flight Path Follies guide

                      A pessimist knows all women are bad... an optimist hopes they are.

                      I reject your reality and substitute my own.

                      All foreign languages are done with Google Translate.

                      Comment


                        If you have the client installed you don't have to wait cabby. Just go ahead and play Bashiok said people could. You don't have to wait for the email as long as your account page has it listed you can play.
                        I'm Rebur, Tadia, or Judianna most games.
                        Twitter @Chaos5061.
                        Translations are done with Google Translate.

                        Comment


                          also last night was another hundred thousand invites sent to annual pass people for a total of 300,000 having been sent out.
                          I'm Rebur, Tadia, or Judianna most games.
                          Twitter @Chaos5061.
                          Translations are done with Google Translate.

                          Comment


                            Okay here is some math. 10 hours ago they sent the third hundred thousand. Bashiok posts later in the thread that flagging that many peoples account for beta could at most take up 55 hours. He said it shouldn't take that long but at the max it could. So 45 more hous until everyone who was supposed to be flagged is at the most. So about 4-5 am in the morning monday CDT time is when they could potentially be done with that wave of invites.
                            I'm Rebur, Tadia, or Judianna most games.
                            Twitter @Chaos5061.
                            Translations are done with Google Translate.

                            Comment


                              I pre-installed the beta Chaos. I still don't have beta flagged on my account.
                              My Flight Path Follies guide

                              A pessimist knows all women are bad... an optimist hopes they are.

                              I reject your reality and substitute my own.

                              All foreign languages are done with Google Translate.

                              Comment


                                Glyphs: What's with the change? Why?

                                I keep looking in threads and see "I hate my choices for glyphs" or "They have no spice."

                                ...What happened? When did we decide glyphs needed to be a give and take type deal? I know you're trying to have it so that it's harder to min-max, but there's also a point where indecisions puts off. People are discomforted by the glyph changes.

                                Please revert them back to the way they were, and instead of spending time changing the glyphs, give us MORE glyphs so that our decisions aren't so one sided instead.

                                Why not have glyphs that CAN'T be placed with other glyphs? "Doesn't apply with <so'n'so glyph>"

                                Edit: Example. Currently there's a glyph that reduces my thunderstorm by 10 sec.

                                Instead of that glyph, have a glyph that makes my thunderstorm a channeled cast for 3 second, increasing the damage and putting it at a longer cooldown. At the end of it have a line that says "Cannot be used with glyph of thunderstorm"

                                There, see? You can have a give and take glyph that make people question their original glyphs, without messing with glyphs already in place.


                                As with talents, we want glyphs to be a choice. Stepping back a moment, we do think there is room in the game for very easy decision -- the kind that don't stress you out for fear of making the wrong one. We don't think glyphs need to be in that category though. We want you to think about them a little bit and not just look up the accepted glyphs for your character.

                                The old prime glyphs were not choices for anyone who cared much about their performance. We designed them to be no-nonsense throughput increasers, because we feared players would find the glyph system confusing if say a Ret paladin couldn't find a glyph that unequivocally increased DPS. But we didn't like how the glyphs actually felt. They were just a hoop to jump through -- something you might choose once for your character and never interact with again. We shoot for simple to learn and complex to master, and prime glyphs were the poster child for simple to learn, simple to master. The current glyph of Templar's Verdict increases damage by 15%. What Retribution paladin wouldn't want that glyph? (The answer is almost none of them.)

                                Now that primes are gone, we want all of the majors to be a choice. Some of these are decisions because they have a bonus and a penalty. In these cases, we thought that the glyph without a penalty would be a no-brainer. The glyph of Riptide removes the cooldown of Riptide, but also removes the initial heal. If it just removed the cooldown of Riptide, then every decent Resto shaman would want the glyph. Without the upfront heal though you have to treat Riptide more like Renew -- trading its initial heal for more healing over time. Some shaman will want that and some won't. Some may want it for some situations only. It is, in game designer parlance, an interesting decision.

                                Another category of major glyphs don't need this downside, because the glyph itself taking one of your precious three slots is sufficient downside. Consider the glyph of Spellsteal, which heals you when you Spellsteal. If you succeed in Spellsteal a lot, then it's a good glyph. But is it better than the glyph of Frost Nova (which lowers its cooldown)? Neither glyph may be exciting to a raiding mage, but both may feel pretty attractive to someone focused on PvP.

                                Minor glyphs have almost no affect on performance. They are there for convenience or increasingly just fun. They should help customize your character with almost no downside (except that again you can only have 3).

                                If we are successful with the glyph revamp, you'll see players with lots of different glyphs out there. Some players will love a certain glyph, while others won't care for it. If you still enjoy playing your character but feel you are stuck in a rut, you can try swapping out a glyph for a little variety in how you play. You won't see someone create a forum thread asking "What glyphs should I use for a Fire mage?" or at least if someone does create that thread, the response will be "Try them out and pick the ones you like."

                                As we continue with beta, letting us know of specific glyphs that you feel are mandatory for a particular type of player would be very useful feedback (not all in this thread, of course).
                                I'm Rebur, Tadia, or Judianna most games.
                                Twitter @Chaos5061.
                                Translations are done with Google Translate.

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